I HAD to give Al "Thumbs Up" just for his comment about Gary. I mean my God folks, Al is dead on right, it's been TWO preseason games. The things that were said by some of the fans here about Gary since Thursday night surprised me a bit. To quote Allen Iverson with a twist..

"But we're talking about preseason man. What are we talking about? Preseason? We're talking about the preseason man?"

R-E-L-A-X!

I agree. Everyone has to remember that the Packers are playing in pre-season schemes here. These schemes are designed to show the opponents nothing that they can gameplan for in the regular season.

Let’s wait until the games count before we start passing judgement on the players, coaches and team.

Oh, and good to hear Dash is banned again. It’s nice to have reasonable input whether I agree with it or not.

Summed up my thoughts to the letter!

The Ravens don’t like to lose preseason games. The Packers are doing both install and tryouts with many new players and coaches. The Ravens simply played better and with more intensity. I remain in the wait and see group of fans.

I thought I was the only one who fell asleep in the first quarter. My Lord even the 1s were pretty brutal. The running game was horrible. I want to put "horrible" in all caps it was so bad. And it seemed like it was just a want to problem with the line. If they do nothing in Winnipeg but trot A-A-ron out for a quarter and have him hand the ball off I'd be fine with that move. This is supposed to be an offense predicated on play action. They have got to be able to run the ball consistently enough and at a respectable enough level to make defenses think run first. That idea is laughable right now.

>>>>Dash Riprock tried to come back<<<
That is funny. He was addicted to himself.

What worried me most about the preseason scrimmage in Baltimore was Baltimore's receivers running around picking up catches around the 5-10 yard line. I've watched that for many years, and am so envious as to how GB doesn't find those plays for its offense; its receivers can't get the separation, or the schemes aren't designed well.
Is it just my frustration negative bias? Do other teams complete more short passes than GB receivers? Seems like it to me.
Others can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the short completion necessitates a well timed concept, more than a deep pass. Given enough protection, the deep pass is going to unfold. The short pass has to be well timed and schemed.
Seems GB just doesn't do the short timed passes very well anymore. But....just might be my frustration bias.

I wonder if Bear fans are in total dismay because they got their asses handed to them by the lowly Giants? Oh wait, it's pre season. I couldn't watch the whole game, I give you credit Al. After I found out AR wasn't suiting up, my interest went right out the window. I was hoping to see the real starting offense for a series or two. We have to remember every NFL team is built around a true starting QB and the Pack has one. No team has more than one.

Big Al, right on with Kizer and Boyle comments. There will be a new back-up...just don't know his name yet. I think the Packers improved the trenches on both sides of the ball and will provide some depth that is needed because of injuries.

Wow Al, polluted or not, this is perhaps the first post anywhere this off and preseason with which I entirely agree!

Your comments on the QBs showing good then bad: isn’t that the definition of a player with potential but not yet able to achieve it sustainably?

I agree on the Madison/Jenkins/Taylor point. I hope that what we are seeing is akin to what LaFleur indicated with Gary: using the preseason to teach for the future and define the strengths and weaknesses outside of the optimal positions.

As far as the Offense goes, we would really need to see A Jones and J Williams and Vitale to see how the RBs factor. D Jones catching yips pretty much undermine the stated design. He could have got his QB killed on one whiff last Thursday as well. If he continues at this rate I see PS as the likely landing spot.

Want to see if Hill or Ford offer more and if the new FB can do more Vitale like things with a week of practice if Vitale remains out. Without that big elements of the stated O necessarily missing.

A year ago, I remained skeptical of Kumerow. At some point, however, repeated achievement against genuine players finally rebuts stats or the past. He has done it against all comers. He should be on the roster and he should get snaps.

That does not mean all camp stars should be anointed as genuine finds. Lazard looks great, but he hasn’t done what Kumerow does as consistently or against true starters to convince me yet.

Conversely, there is something about Shepherd and his field awareness that makes me think he is genuine even though the same applies. I just don’t see Davis reading the play and getting into position to make those catches.

My confession is I never really believed the Kumerow hype since last year. He seems to have turned into one hell of a solid player. Never saw that coming at all, I basically thought he was a practice hero or my nickname "Practice Jesus." We are seeing him win routes against starting corners. I still do not see a ton of future growth, I think he is a solid possession receiver and this is still his ceiling but I was wrong about him.

Everything is obvious. But the mental problems are still coming. Gute tried to solve the back up QB problem by trading Randll. He hasn't! Gute went against everything I've seen with Gary. Switching him to OLB. was not putting this defense FIRST! Lowrey is a failure at LDE. In college he played on the Right side. I keep on wondering if we shouldn't just go back to the 4-3-4 to solve the problems. And add ILB to that. Turner is such a plus on the OL. I hope they don't move him to RT and screw up the OL. I Believe the starters will be fine. Back-ups? Try again Gute. Kumerow can replace Allison. But Rodgers still needs the explosion, of a Nelson ,Cobb and Finley in their prime..

I like Sheppard over Davis. What we need is shifty, not so much speed. And I never liked Davis's decision making on punt returns.

Thanks for the update. Have no way of watching the Pack stuck in a motel in North East Lion country.

This whole “vanilla” thing is used too often as an excuse. BOTH teams played vanilla and the Packers clearly were the weaker and softer team. Yes, we didn’t have a couple of our top guys out there, but it’s been proven that these top guys have not been able to carry a winning season the last 2 years. It has to be done with the offense and defense and right now, we will be in trouble again if this tackling thing is not addressed.

Lowery wasn't the only Packer defender who had a bad night. Our run defense hasn't been good in either preseason game. Lowery/Adams/Lancaster are going to have to step it up or cutting Daniels is going to come back and bite the Packers.

Al - first thanks for banning Dash and his numerous pseudonyms yet again.

As for the rest of the article your comments are pretty much spot on. This entire season will be a learning experience for Gary. I expect him to be more of a contributor in 2020 than in 2019.

Hopefully we will never need to see our backup QBs in a real game other than in a mop up role.

As I posted yesterday in a different thread, if our defensive starters remain healthy our defense will be fine. The same is true for the offense. Our starting OL is solid, our depth not so much. Thanks, Since ‘61

In a press conference, OC Hackett stated that the offense at this point was deliberately vanilla. As he put it, why let other teams see what they're going to face? So, yeah, the offense is vanilla; as is the defense; as are the "games", where you simply hope that no one gets hurt. But inevitably, someone does.

After the last couple of seasons suggesting Packers fans be patient this season is a tough sell. But it is unrealistic to think a rookie HC (the Packers have never had one make the playoffs in his first season, including Lombardi) installing a brand new offense and a defense with more first time starters than returning starters will hit the ground running. My expectation is the Packers will be playing much better football after midseason than on opening night. (I’ve argued before one of the reasons Daniels was released is because Gutekunst realizes this too.)

If you are desperate for reassurance, think back to what Pettine did last year with the “talent” available to him at the time. There’s no question this year’s defense is much more talented. Regarding Gary, Pettine may use him mainly as an inside pass rusher once the season begins. His combination of strength and quickness could be tough for OGs to handle, particularly with Clark and Za’darius on the same DL.

Coach Smith remains very high on Gary so I will stay hopeful the young man learns how to be an impact OLB.

Watching Kumero run routes is magical. Also he has really good hands. He did drop one pass and no one was more upset than him.

Regarding vanilla play calling, I wonder (hoping?) if we might see something like the opener last year in reverse. Nagy in his first game came out with fresh, new plays. Went right down the field without a problem. It was kind of shocking. Then the new toy (Mack) had a career half, our QB was hurt and we were forced to rally in the second.

I’d love to see MLF do something similar. There is no way Trubisky mounts a similar comeback.

I get the whole "slow down" thing, but Rashan Gary looks a whole heck of a lot like one of the many "athletic freaks" who are not very good football players.

- Backup QB: I have arrived at the opinion that they will be no worse off taking a random promising looking QB at final cutdowns. The options are between maybe finding a better QB vs keeping Kizer/Boyle and knowing that neither guy can get the job done but the losses will be closer.

- Gary: He has the athleticism. Packers took a dice roll, which is what all draft picks are. It will take 3 years to figure out what they have. Pronouncing final judgment after 2 preseason games only shows personal ignorance of draft and develop.

- Starting Defense: Looks improved vs pass. Need to greatly improve the run defense. It looked bad.

Regarding Gary, who I was not wanting us to pick, a position/scheme change in the NFL is significant. I read Khalil Mack didn’t get his first sack until week 10 and I looked up that he only had 4 sacks his first year. The player I wanted, at 12, was Ed Oliver and I see he has no tackles and 1 pd and he didn’t get moved to OLB. Playing in space is so much more difficult that I am willing to be patient and bank on the coaches getting Gary at a point that he contributes and continues to grow.

I’ve watched it four times now.

I still think we trail the Bears and Vikes, but we’ve closed the gap.

The defense....for all the moaning...gave up two TDS. One was a completion on Sullivan that he misplayed and the other was five yard drive after a turnover.

Not worried about Gary at all. On my first job after college I didn’t dominate immediately either; it was more about surviving each day.

The offensive line is better than last year, and it was above average last year. Turner and Jenkins are improvements, Bulaga and Taylor are healthy. This is a good group.

I like our secondary, too. Brown has impressed.

I don’t think our defense is Top Ten, but we should be at least average. If we can win the turnover battle and if Rodgers is healthy and plays well, we should have a chance at a winning season. That’s three IFs.

The angst over these preseason games is misplaced.

I live a...hmmm....7 hour or so drive from Green Bay so I have seen no practices. But based on the reports the Packers are still doing "training camp practices" and not doing "regular season practices". That is they are still installing plays, and comparing players at positions. They have done no scout team preparing for the week's opponent type of stuff. So in that regard they should not be expected to look prepared for the game. At this point you have to only evaluate players not the team.

That said the players still need to freaking tackle better.

Kizer, though not overwhelming, definitely looked better than Boyle this time. I think the Packers keep Kizer because Gute seems determined to wring some value from his trade. Besides, who else is available right now?

Thanks Al for sharing your polluted mind. It’s one of my highlight reads each week. I couldn’t agree with you more on your attitude about the preaseason. This week’s article reminded me of the Super Bowl winning 49ers. It seemed that their preseasons under Coach Walsh were filled with loses, but when the regular seasons came, the 49ers just dominated season after season. I didn’t follow the 49ers preseasons, but they obviously were doing something right during those head scratching loses to prepare for another great year.

I didn't say BUST

In the distant past, in a seemingly long-forgotten era before the advent of free agency, the Packers made a trade for a future HOF linebacker by the name of Ted Hendricks. Sadly, he only played one season for the Green and Gold, but the thing I remember my Father telling me is how soft he was in the pre-season (guy just stands around a lot), and then, how the switch turned on once the season began.

Can I compare a HOF'er to a rookie? No. Can I draw some comparisons? Absolutely.

Do you know what Hendricks did in 1974 with Green Bay?

From Wikipedia:

"five interceptions, seven blocked kicks (3 field goals, 3 punts and 1 extra point) and a safety, two sacks, 75 tackles, and two knocked down passes while again earning consensus All-Pro honors for the second time." Al Davis then proceeded to give us 2 1st-rounders for his contract.

My point is: don't put too much stock in the pre-season. A guy going all-out, and getting injured in a game with no bearing on the regular season does the team, or the player no good.

Have a cold one, enjoy what's left of summer, and we'll see how things go when the rubber meets the road. This is year two of a major re-build. You could argue it is year one, but I think it started last year. That is why I have a more positve outlook on the coming season. These guys are gonna' be good!

I’m not worried nor surprised. First preseason game LaFleur’s team came out ready. 2nd preseason not so much. Still were some positives.

Just looking to see the best rise to the top. It’s a process.