Health and Safety for Beginners Forums

Please can I have some opinions on this...

We have final exit doors on a building which are electronically locked for access control reasons i.e. to stop public walking in.

The doors have Type A emergency override switches (green boxes) and we understand they fail safe and unlock if a power loss occurs.

BUT, they don't automatically release when the building fire alarm is actuated. The building is just a traditional office block so no prisoners, psychiatric patients, etc.

BS7273-4:2015...to me, this suggests that all electronically locked doors should release upon actuation of fire alarm, except for few scenarios such as those mentioned above...

But, tenant is worried that potential thieves could stick something smoking through or under the perimeter doors and either cause the AFD to actuate an alarm, therefore releasing the doors. Or put something through the gaps/underneath the door and manually set of the alarm using the MCP.

So, we could secure the letter plate and adjust doors to remove any gaps to avoid this happening...problem solved I thought...

Another consultant has said that they don't have to make sure the doors automatically release upon actuation of fire alarm...but cannot/won't give me guidelines why other than the security issues. I've quoted the BS7273-4:2015 (section 7) and they have said that this is just a guide and is a "should" and not a "must"....

Any help much appreciated. If I am misunderstanding this, please point me in right direction!!

Well your Consultant is right, they don't 'Have to'.
Would a Bank, or a Jewellery store allow all doors to open on the Fire Alarm sounding?

You haven't said if they are only secured with electrical locks or if there is another Push Bar required to open them. I'm assuming there is? However you have said

But, tenant is worried that potential thieves could stick something smoking through or under the perimeter doors and either cause the AFD to actuate an alarm, therefore releasing the doors. Or put something through the gaps/underneath the door and manually set of the alarm using the MCP.

So perhaps there is only the electronic lock, in which case, how do you stop them all swinging open in a power cut?
if you've got failsafe to unlock, you can't rely on 100% guarantee of supply to keep the building secure.

You haven't said if there are members of the public involved or only trained staff.

It might only be an office block, but the occupier is still entitled to keep it secure to protect commercial interests.

I've worked in highly secure buildings, with turnstile entry; when the alarm was activated, the turnstiles went 'free to rotate', but only in an outward direction.


What I really don't get is the statement

We have final exit doors on a building which are electronically locked for access control reasons i.e. to stop public walking in.

Any regular Final Exit door would do that, they are generally after all, one-way doors, unless fitted with an external opener.

I feel there is some key fact missing from your explanation, or else someone has gone to extremes in the past.

Bottom line, do your Fire Risk Assessment and work it out.

Firstly, a British standard is indeed guidance - in fact best practice. If you decide to veer away from any standard, you are expected to achieve at least what the BS requires or better. Some lateral thinking is permitted if its risk assessed and mitigating control measures are proposed.

So it may be possible to have the doors to a 'upon request' unlock, citing security as the reason for the variation.

Some questions:

How many people would be expected to use the electrically locked doors? (is a green break glass unit acceptable if high numbers?)

What would be the method of opening the door when the first evacuees arrive?

How often do you test the green break glass manual override? (if the doors do not release on the weekly fire test, you may need an alternative test regime to ensure that door will open every time upon request)

Is the concern here theft during out of hours? (i.e. when the premises is empty?).

What is the premises used for and what is the nature of the business conducted (if you can say)

Hi Messy,

Thank you for your reply - answers as follows;

Maximum of 40 people would be expected to use the electrically locked doors.

In day to day use, the door is released from internally using a simple push button ("mushroom") which releases the door.

The door currently has no emergency override switch so is having one installed on Monday next week - our report states it should be tested weekly with fire alarm system.

Good question...they have concerns as youths have in the past broken in during the day (or tailgated members of staff), hidden themselves away, and then stolen at night. They have introduced sweeps of rooms before leaving building, CCTV and alarm but attempted break-ins re-occur. Not the best area in the world.

The building is a small 2 storey office block used as an estate agent, basic office admin, meetings, etc....no banks/jewellers/prisoners/psychiatric patients.

Thanks as always.

But why the electronic lock?
Is there a keypad/dongle/swipe entry from outside?
Is it one door or more?

If it's already got a Mushroom Button to release it, why install a Green Break Glass?
They will both be doing the same thing - A Button is a Button.... OK, it's an additional parallel wired Button, just in case the Mushroom fails, (belt & braces) but you could just as easily put 2 Mushrooms there. A Break Glass is usually to override a more 'secure' situation.

The doors in question are double doors which can be opened from the outside by staff using a fob key. In addition, the report states that a key can also unlock the door from the outside...I am assuming this is so that staff can gain access to the building if the electronic locks jam overnight?!

No idea why the assessor has asked for an emergency override switch in addition to the mushroom...guessing as you say its belt and braces.

The doors are high street facing - so whilst they are used as fire exits, they are also used as the main entrance for staff and visitors. They are electronically locked to prevent members of public walking in off the street (or they say they have in the past found homeless people in the entrance foyer, and in bad weather, public used the foyer to keep warm & dry).

From my point of view - and taking into account my blind perspective - it does not seem unreasonable for your proposals to go ahead - unless you can support the removal of the smoke detection of course (not my preferred option).

The fact there is a history of break-ins/criminality at this address and you suggest this is not a nice area should form part of your assessment to justify the variation from The BS.

You should mention the fact the green override is being tested more frequently than would be required as an additional control measure, I would also place a sign over the device explaining what it is 'Break Glass to release door in an emergency' (or similar).

I wouldn't get too hung up on not being at the extreme security end of the market (bank/mental health unit). In addition, keeping uninvited wrong uns out also plays a part in arson reduction and in my experience, areas that are 'not the best' also generally have a higher arson risk in the first place.

That is quite a history of crime for a relatively small building. Where is this place? Kabul????

Berni - what do think?......

Hello Messy - thank you for your thoughts - always a great help to novices like me. Are you agreeing that the consultant is correct in that the doors do not need to release upon alarm actuation?? Sorry if i've mis-read your last message.

With regards to the weekly testing (again forgive me as I'm just reading this from the assessors report) but it states that they must test the green boxes every week, as per BS7273-4:2015 (section 21 - Maintenance). Do they not need to test it every week? I have had a read of the section the assessor has referred to, but can see the weekly testing he is referring to...and also a six-monthly inspection/test by competent person?

I've visited the location with the assessor and shadowed him on previous visits...Kabul looks like Monaco compared to this place mate!! High levels of alcohol and drug abuse in the area / streets so I can understand the clients thought in not wanting the doors to automatically open. I was just asking the question as our assessor has said they MUST release upon alarm actuation... the tenants consultant has said they don't have to.

Sorry...and does anyone know what the BS/EN is for the actual emergency BGU we need to tell the client to install?? I've found BS EN 54-11 but think that only relates to Fire MCPs... I've spent ages on Google and reading the BS7273-4 but cant see where the exact model is specified (If it does at all??)

I don't believe there is a specific BS for them as Door Releases, they are after all just push buttons, so will be covered by other specs such as Weatherproofing where required, i.e. IP44 etc.
I suppose it might be buried in some obscured BS relating to Alarm Systems, but it's not something easily found. I've certainly not seen it in any catalogue descriptions.

You might wish to consider whether a Single or Double Pole unit is being fitted.
I guess that would depend on the complexity of the overall control system and what line(s) they are looking to interrupt.

I am also not sure if there is a specific BS.

Think about this: A standard set up would be in 3 x phases:
1) Fire alarm activates > Doors Unlock/open. If that fails:
2) Staff operate 'mushroom' switch. If that fails:
3) Staff operate override.

On the proposed system, you only have 2 phases (2&3 above). It is essential you have the most resilient system. So where there is a choice (say, single or double pole switching), I would choose double pole. I would also try to copy the standards (as far as possible) for a fire alarm manual call point.

We also have significant security reasons to not allow automatic unlatching of final exit doors. So in addition to the normal opening device (normally an ID swipe), we have a green box override and the whole system is backed up on a building UPS and a local UPS - a battery located locally at each door. OK our needs are slighter greater than yours, but some kind of UPS might be a good idea - or necessary if this is the only escape route (a question I rlier!)

You have 40 people escaping through your locked door, where have over 600, so we need a belt and braces set up to prevent a big stdering bodies and public inquiry!!

I don’t think there is a specific BS/EN, but good practice is to use double pole green BGU.

And, if single action exit is required, an electronic push bar or thumb turn and latch are more appropriate.